think about a platoon of soldiers serially gang-banging nubile teen-agers
think there’s any doubt about winners and losers?
can you think now?
can you?

i can almost hear it
can you?

By that logic, Nazi-Germany would have won WWII. Lying down weapons only makes sense if you really have no chance to win. I hope Selensky orders the soldiers in Mariupol to give up, if they really can‘t help them. But to surrender if there is still a chance, would mean to motivy Putin and other powerful states, to take what they want by force and to view democratic states based on human rights as weak. And Putin will take in all other former east-block states turned to sovereign entities, which aren‘t in the NATO yet as well. The same with Russian geostrategic goals. This is the main reason why Europe and the USA have to support the Ukraine with all means. The moral reason is another. Russia is the main aggressor, starting the war and also targeting civilians, killing and raping them. In Europe. Shame on you to demand from them and the West to let the Russians or any other aggressor attack other countries without that they defend themselves.

Another Green Party member, actually the only one I really respected, Winfried Kretschmann, replied to the writers of the open letter, that the intellectuals among them could have put in more effort. He is more diplomatic than I am, lol.

don’t they have chat rooms for germans?
gunda’s english is as good as my german
that’s why i don’t type german
soon, we’ll be dancing in the sun
and we’ll sing your song together
but first
where is your daughter?

the logic is that wars can never be won by anyone therefore weapons should never be picked up in the first place

real defense is never done with violence
economic sanctions will take a lot of time but they are working, russia is losing a lot of money

i do not feel any shame for demanding all humans to act humane, i do feel pity for those that dont

I don’t feel more weapons would end this war quicker. I don’t know anyone who thinks that. Obviously if the Ukrainians had no weapons, the war would have been over very quickly. I support more weapons for Ukraine because it is right to do that and shameful not to do that. It will make the war longer, but it may lead to victory.

guten albumin
wheren ist von teenerschitzel?
danka uber alles

I wonder if the russians driving the tanks are complaining about diesel prices
Around 6.49 a gallon here. Of course if they run out of fuel, they don’t have to kill as many people and might sleep better.

Trudeau is in Ukraine meeting Zelensky and reopening the Canadian embassy. I’ve been irritated with him but he does it right sometimes.

Agreed to the last part. But without explanation of your first half-sentence, I disagree. WWII for example clearly has winners and losers.

Without violence, the Ukraine wouldn‘t stay souvereign and instead become another autocratic state like Belarus, Chechnya or Russia. No wonder they rather defend themselves - and btw. by doing so, they defend also us and our souvereignity.

Do you agree, that Hitler-Germany would have won WWII, if the responsible non-German politicians back then shared your position? If so, you would still find your attitude justified? Can you explain why?

Russia is too powerful to sanction effectively. Not all western economies have that capacity.

of course not, there are only losers in wars
if the responsible politicians all over the world shared my vision hitler would never have become that powerful in the first place
its quite disgraceful that so many were doing business with nazi germany right up to and during ww2

russia is powerful but is being sanctioned and yes it could be done more effectively
most western economies would take a (big) hit, but they all have that capacity

What a lot of nonsense, Nico. You’re a politician in Britain on September 3, 1939. Germany has just invaded a bunch of its neighbours. Hindsight will not help you. Do you declare war or not? I do.

she asked a question, i asnwered… what is nonsense to one… is truth to another :wink:

i will assume you mean a violent war… then of course not; those never solve anything

beware that, when fighting monsters, you yourself do not become a monster… for when you gaze long into the abyss, the abyss gazes also into you - friedrich nietzsche

you should quote nietzche some more
or maybe chamberlain

Some of his remarks about women are among the most offensive of Nietzsche’s writings. I take these to be indications of the extent to which he was a man of his time who could not see beyond the existing cultural forms of the sexual division of humankind. Like the vast majority of nineteenth century European men, Nietzsche could not divorce female affect, intelligence and corporeal capacities from a supposed “essential’ relation to child-bearing.

You answered with a lot of nonsense about things they should have done so they wouldn’t be in that situation. Any competent adult understands that when you find yourself in a bad situation, you need to take the best action possible to remedy that situation and not worry about what you should have done differently in the past.

Beyond that, while it’s easy to see in hindsight that some actions were bad, at the time they seemed sensible. For instance, everyone can now see that Europe’s reliance on Russian energy was a mistake. At the time, however, it seemed perfectly reasonable. Putin was showing no signs of his current lunacy and none of the players from 10 or 15 years ago can be blamed for today’s situation.

And yes, war will turn you into a monster but it’s sometimes still the right answer. Allow yourself to lose your humanity so that future generations can keep theirs. It’s not even a sacrifice as there are no alternatives on the table that involve keeping your humanity. Go to war and kill others or give in and live under a dictator.

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lol sure but she asked "what would happen “if”… then of course my answer will include things that should/would happen if …

all can be blamed for today’s situation!
just because putin is the one that took this step, doesnt mean its some unfortunate-one of a kind-will never happen again bug that infected putin lol
a lot of other countries and their leaders have this “bug” and could have easily been in similar positions

there is nothing “sensible” or “reasonable” about our world politics let alone about doing business with a nazi germany or doing business with putin right now…
it is all about the money

as soon as you find out you make a mistake, you can correct it
yes it will have (major) consequences but it can and should be done

i wonder if putin thinks in the same way?
war is never the right answer; if you are willing to become that monster there is no turning back, there will be a lasting impact on you, your family, everyone around you and all future generations

there are always better alternatives;
remaining humane is always the option, be yourself, do what you can and live your life the way you want or die trying

i can’t see that
i am part of everyone
please explain
show your work

first there is a ukraine
then there is no ukraine
then there is